Good Intel From Tyler Cowen

Tyler Cowen of Marginal Revolution looks at the variety of epidemiological models for coronavirus and stays with the "better safe than sorry" approach. I concur. He also links to this excellent non-firewalled FT piece by Tim Harford.

A major part of the controversy revolves around the question of just how many people could already have contracted COVID19 asymptomatically. We can test for antibodies so it should be possible to answer this question. A project is proposed in the UK and this Dutch blood bank study of donors should be interesting. I would guess we'd hear about results somewhat promptly. A few weeks, maybe?

Comments

[Pinandpuller]

Are we going to start getting judges to sign off on warrants for blood?

In other news my wife says for the first time in her adult life she’s disappointed in Trump. She says even a small hospital probably has about 15 ventilators and Trump is clearly talking in ignorance. Not the first time in his adult life.

[Pinandpuller]

Covid has a pretty good agent because it keeps getting top billing on the Death Certificates.

[KevlarKid]

"You learn to know a pilot in a storm.”

-Seneca

[KevlarKid]

missing daddy.

[Pinandpuller]

We made a desert and called it CARE.

[Pinandpuller]

The morbidity rate of the Covid-19 on Civil Rights is 100%.

[MissMarple2]

Well, it's amazing to me how many people expect Trump to have made the absolutely correct medical decision as well as keep the economy going without much help from anyone outside of a small circle of advisers.

I can just imagine the continuing economic disaster if this bill were blocked, and I can see how wonderfully the fall election would have gone.

Bah. I am going to the White House web site and watch my president, the best president in my lifetime, sign that damn bill and I will not be back here for a bit. I am going to hang around on Twitter and talk to Carlos Osweda and folks like that.

Maybe I will see you guys later this evening.

[henry]

A few weeks of no economy. On the precautionary principle. We are in the circle of hell designed and run by trial lawyers.

[Threadkiller]

I can just imagine the continuing economic disaster if this bill were blocked, and I can see how wonderfully the fall election would have gone.

?

I guess I agree. I too can’t imagine why our representatives weren’t in DC. Good for Massie!

[Marlene]

Good afternoon! Maine's Gov. Janet Mills is asking travelers from hard hit virus areas to self quarantine. Summer residents have been driving up to Maine from New York and other areas. The Bangor Daily News reports there is "interfamilial confusion" because her brother (Peter Mills) said sorry sis! He is the executive director of the Maine DOT. She said she wants the electronic signs set up in Kittery with the warning message and he told his sister the signs can't relay that many words. For some reason,"interfamilial confusion" made me laugh.

[henry]

Cowan conflates a “rich country like China or Italy” with one with perpetual debt crises requiring EU bailouts, overrun by third world “migrants”, and an underfunded nationalized health care system and the other a communist shithole without sanitation with a functioning economy and private healthcare system.

Compare ICU beds per million population between those and here. He’s comparing apples and shitholes, then forcing shithole policy on us.

[Extraneus]

Hillary Clinton under fire for joke about US leading in virus cases: Trump 'did promise America First'

[Gentlejim]

Due to being adjacent to a county in Michigan I routinely monitor their radio traffic. They actually have people calling in and reporting people for gathering. Today’s complaint was that there were 15 people on a beach.

I call dibs on the long knife and brown shirt concessions.

[MJW]

Iggy: Where do they think X and Y come from? They come from epidemiologists making estimates every year based on the closest values they can come up with for R0 and mortalities caused by influenza.

I'll bite. How much more accurate are the pre-influenza-season fatality predictions based of the factors you list versus naive forecasts based only on recent years' fatality rates and population changes?

[D]

TK:
Order of business today-pass the bill in the House
Maddie needs to get with the program or get out of Congress
Totally agree with the President’s tweet.

[Captain Hate]

A few weeks of no economy. On the precautionary principle. We are in the circle of hell designed and run by trial lawyers.

I'm really pissed off at how this has played out and I'm not getting unpissed for a long time.

[D]

Iggy and TK:
On former thread I outline why I disagree with you both.

[Captain Hate]

It's not the first time Rodham has cackled over American deaths.

[henry]

@cnbc

BREAKING: Trump orders General Motors to make ventilators under Defense Production Act

[Threadkiller]

And I handled your mistakes accordingly, maryrose.

Hopefully you keep it over there.

[Threadkiller]

Didn’t Trump tweet a demand that GM start using their plant in Lordstown? I thought GM sold that plant in November?

[Captain Hate]

Yes, Lordstown was sold to some electric vehicle startup.

[D]

MM:
I agree with you completely
Whiners here don’t like the bill.
Boo Hoo.
Nothing is perfect and of course Dems will get their pork.
It is a given.
Passing that bill guarantees President Trump’s re-election.
Anyone who knows politics is aware of that.
Two nephews of mine will come out better now that it has passed, so yes it is personal for me.
My son will get a check which will help him because of reduced hours at his place of work. I cannot afford to be disapproving and sanctimonious when relatives livelihoods are on the line.

[D]

Just think OL now your rents will be paid.

[Threadkiller]

Thomas Massie Retweeted

Cliff Maloney
@LibertyCliff
·
1h
EVERY AMERICAN NEEDS TO HEAR THIS

"They don't want to be on record as making the biggest mistake in history."

-
@RepThomasMassie

https://mobile.twitter.com/RepThomasMassie

Video at link

[Threadkiller]

My issue is summed up at the link above, maryrose.

Save your boo-hoos for your Romney confessional.

[D]

Massie May have gone to MIT but he is kind of tone deaf when it comes to politics.
As an intellectual he fails to read the room and realize what is at stake.
Buried in numbers he needs to get his head out of the sand and realize real live people’s secure future is at stake.
Pelosi wasted a week.
No time to lose now.

[MJW]

To clarify my previous comment a bit.
By "pre-influenza-season fatality predictions" I mean predictions made for the coming influenza season before it has began. What I'm interested in is evidence that complex models do substantially better than just using historical data adjusted for population changes.

[D]

TK:
You take a stand , then when confronted you backtrack.
It is your modus operandi.
I am sure other posters have noticed it as well.
You are dead wrong about Massie here, just saying.

[Threadkiller]

I will also take a break, like MM. Hopefully, but doubtfully, maryrose will understand what is being debated by the time I get back.

[Threadkiller]

Maryrose, you don’t ever know what track others are on when you drop poopy pearls of wisdom around the place. I’m sure other posters have noticed it as well.

[Momto2]

Sorry but reposting from the dead thread.

anonamom - Thanks so much! I agree he does look pretty exhausted! One thing he said that really stuck out to me was something like, "this virus is a wimp" meaning that it is easily destroyed using a variety of soaps, hand sanitizer, etc. It's not like some super-bug that gets on you and can not be easily killed.

Someone posted the array of regular household products that they (maybe the CDC?) claimed could be used against the virus. I was surprised at the variety and had expected them to say we needed to use some type of hospital-grade disinfectant. This was encouraging to me and to my daughter who is quickly becoming a germ-a-phobe and the hand police.

Your expertise is invaluable to many of us! Thank you for sharing your knowledge.

[GUS]

I think the most important thing to remember is that the GOVERNMENT can take your RIGHTS any time it likes.

Tell me I'm wrong.

[lyle]

The only thing I want to read about Hilligula should follow with these words: died suddenly. What a horrible see ya next Tuesday.

[Old Lurker]

What Cap'n said at 4:10.

And Trump owns it.

[Jane]

OL,

Serious question: if you were President what would you have done about the virus.

Anyone else feel free to answer.

[KevlarKid]

Any tonnage estimates for printed regulatory " guidelines" that will accompany this relief package?

[MissMarple2]

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump

I just signed the CARES Act, the single biggest economic relief package in American History – twice as large as any relief bill ever enacted. At $2.2 Trillion Dollars, this bill will deliver urgently-needed relief for our nation’s families, workers, and businesses. #CARESAct

[Old Lurker]

Maryrose "Just think OL now your rents will be paid."

1. If my rent has to be taken by force from innocent neighbors and paid back by my grandchildren or theirs, then you can keep it, Maryrose.

2. If my grandchildren have to live in a system where #1 can happen behind closed doors and by faceless votes of politicians, then you can keep it, Maryrose.

3. Having read the relevant pages of the Act myself, if you think the moms and pops running my barbershops are going to navigate the gates to receive free rent money from the sky just so they can send it to me, then you do not understand small business, Maryrose.

4. If I get a dollar of rent from this bill, you can have it, Maryrose.

Sometimes words are just words, bullshit is just bullshit, and there really is not a pony beneath it all.

[Threadkiller]

Thomas Massie

@RepThomasMassie
·
4h

(1/11)I swore an oath to uphold the constitution, and I take that oath seriously.

In a few moments I will request a vote on the CARES Act which means members of Congress will vote on it by pushing “yes” or “no” or “present.”

(2/11)The Constitution requires that a quorum of members be present to conduct business in the House. Right now, millions of essential, working-class Americans are still required to go to work during this pandemic such as manufacturing line workers, healthcare professionals,

(3/11) pilots, grocery clerks, cooks/chefs, delivery drivers, auto mechanics, and janitors (to name just a few). Is it too much to ask that the House do its job, just like the Senate did.

(4/11) I am not delaying the bill like Nancy Pelosi did last week. The bill that was worked on in the Senate late last week was much better before Speaker Pelosi showed up to destroy it and add days and days to the process.

(5/11) This bill should have been voted on much sooner in both the Senate and House and it shouldn’t be stuffed full of Nancy Pelosi’s pork- including $25 million for the Kennedy Center, grants for the National Endowment for the Humanities and Arts, and millions more.

(6/11) other measures that have no direct relation to the Coronavirus Pandemic. That $25 million, for example, should go directly to purchasing test kits. The number one priority of this bill should have been to expand testing availability and creation of tests.

(7/11) so that every American, not just the wealthy and privileged, have access to testing. We have shut down the world’s economy without adequate data. Everyone, even those with no symptoms, needs immediate access to a test.

(8/11) This bill creates even more secrecy around a Federal Reserve that still refuses to be audited. It allows the Federal Reserve to make decisions about who gets what, how much money we’ll print. With no transparency.

(9/11) If getting us into $6 trillion more debt doesn’t matter, then why are we not getting $350 trillion more in debt so that we can give a check of $1 million to every person in the country?

(10/11) This stimulus should go straight to the people rather than being funneled through banks and corporations like this bill is doing.

(11/11) 2 trillion divided by 150 million workers is about $13,333.00 per person. That’s much more than the $1,200 per person check authorized by this bill

[MissMarple2]

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
12m
News conference live from the @WhiteHouse
today. 5:30 P.M. Eastern!

[Old Lurker]

TK, that sure sounds like a quack that a Republican POTUS should run out of the Republican Party, don't you think?

I ended my first post about the flu several weeks ago with one word: "Lunacy".

Today confirms it.

Lunacy.

[Threadkiller]

Hopefully at 5:31 the Kabuki will be explained.

[Threadkiller]

Flunacy

[GUS]

Momto2, we CAN TAKE AMERICANS RIGHTS AWAY, and put them under house arrest.

We can't try new drugs, because they haven't been tested to te GOVERNMENTS satisfaction.

THIS IS NOT AMERICA.

[anonamom]

Jane, I can't tell you how many people I have shut up with that very question.

[Threadkiller]

My best rationalization of this is that until late this week Trump has no clue who Massie was. Some chicken little-dick staffer ran into the office and cried “the Bill is failing! THE BILL IS FAILING!!” to which trump took a twit shot from the hip. Trump does not take anything back, so he is now hoping the two week rule of forgetting the past will apply.

[Jj532aa]

Jane, 4:34. I wanted Trump to fight Pelosi to the end and even if the bill passed, refuse to sign it. However, the man couldn't do that because of the time frame. He'd be standing on piles and piles of corpses, their lungs filled with mucous, their faces black and contorted from no oxygen. Lunatics would be running in the street, burning, destroying, because the left incited them (think Ferguson, MO, was that the city? or LA, back in the day over riots, think any of the riots of the past decades.) Once that black-hearted bitch and her masters decided they wouldn't budge, Trump could see this wasn't the hill to die on.

He's got to be reelected. The Republicans have to take the senate, the house. They can undo some of this that we hate so much in the bill. Sometimes even the greatest generals have to change course. He's a brave man. I can't believe anyone can judge him who hasn't gone through what he has gone through the past four years.

I said in a post a day or so ago, I sent a message to him that I wanted him not to sign Pelosi's bill and that I'd rather take a dagger in my heart than have her win, but I'm sitting here in my little world, safe and secure. I knew in my heart I wouldn't be that brave. Not to see my daughter and her husband unemployed. My grandchildren raised in the coming years without the safety and security that I want for them. My parents use to talk about the people they'd see hitchhiking along highways, breadlines, sheer, ugly poverty. Unless you've lived it, you wouldn't be cavalier about sticking to conservative or liberal principles.

The moment the republicans didn't start supporting Trump in his first year, people like Ryan and the other establishment, and the evil people started wave after wave of repulsive Russian lies, and the press joined in like laughing hyenas, he's stood practically alone. He signed this bill because he didn't want to see ordinary, decent people lose everything. What conservatives lost today, then another generation of them can retake some time down the road.

And, I haven't gone back to edit or make this coherent. This is exactly how I feel.

[GUS]

Did they vote to UPHOLD THE CONSTITUTION or is this CRISIS EXEMPT from the pesky bunch of crap written by OLD WHITE DUDES 240 YEARS AGO??

[Threadkiller]

if you were President what would you have done about the virus.

Anyone else feel free to answer.

I hope this question is part of some premise that OL, myself, and others think that Trump has done everything incorrectly. That wouldn’t be a fair question at all, so I’ll assume it is a think tank type of “how would you have improved the President’s response?” type of question.

I would have closed the north and south borders and Europe sooner.

[henry]

I can’t wait to see the Dow when nobody can pay dividends for a couple years. #abyss

[Threadkiller]

I hope this question isn’t part of...

[Extraneus]

He does sound kind of quackish to me, in the sense that he's disagreeing with the bill itself, not just the way it was passed. Regarding how it passed, it was a done deal. If he had succeeded in delaying it, Massie would have been one of the few who voted against it. It still would have passed. He wasn't going to get the pork out of the bill; that stuff was negotiated and agreed to by a unanimous Senate, including conservatives. After a meaningless delay, a House majority would have overwhelmingly gone along, even on a recorded vote.

I agree with Trump and Kerry. (Statements formerly never uttered for $800, Alex?)

[Extraneus]

Btw, the stock market nosedived after the bill was passed...

[Threadkiller]

There would have been no delay if just over 200 members of the House were in DC. Has any intrepid reporter asked for that count? If that quorum was there, then they could have signed off on the bill that was as inevitable as Thanos.

Massie appears to have been a yes voter to the previous bill. Where was Trump’s nasty tweets to all the others when it mattered then?

[MJW]

My best rationalization of this is that until late this week . . .

I don't think it's that, and I don't think it's complicated. Since the bill was certain to pass, Trump thought it Massie was needlessly endangering House members to make a point. Some, including me, think it was a point worth making, but to a result-oriented person like Trump, it seemed foolish and dangerous.

[Jane]

Geez TK, Do you ever do anything but look for a fight?

[MJW]

. . . Trump thought it Massie was . . .

[Jj532aa]

Trump was being impeached through which months? When did the investigation start? November? December? When was the trial? January? What else was he doing when we heard the news leaking out of China? Anything else to worry about? He can't even get his justice department to mete or allot the proper investigations and justice to the plotters working against him.

He's not a perfect man. There are still times he annoys me. But he didn't destroy this country or the constitution or founding principles by signing this bill. The left and the democrats, and especially the media are the ones at fault here. They deserve our contempt and hatred.

It's easy to sit here judging him and debate when he should have closed borders -- which he's been trying to do for more than three years.

Honestly, I don't understand being as virtuous as so many here.

[Threadkiller]

I get that and I agree, MJW. I am reasoning why he reacted in such a ridiculous manner. If he can have the likes of Pelosi and Schumer visit the Whitehouse as part of his art of the deal horse trading, he certainly could have reached out to Massie in a different fashion.

[Threadkiller]

Yes, Jane. I fix broken appliances for my online friends.

[Extraneus]

VOTING AND QUORUM PROCEDURES IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

The Constitution requires that a quorum, or a simple majority of the Members, is to be present on the floor when the House of Representatives transacts business. However, the House conducts much of its legislative business in Committee of the Whole where this constitutional requirement does not apply. Also, the House always presumes that a quorum is present unless and until its absence is demonstrated conclusively.

The rules of the House severely limit the occasions on which a Representative
may make a point of order that a quorum is not present, either in the House or in
Committee of the Whole. In current practice, Members usually make such a point of
order only when a vote is taking place. If a majority of the Members fail to respond
to a quorum call or participate in an electronically recorded vote conducted in the
House, the House must adjourn or take steps necessary to secure the attendance of
enough Members to constitute a quorum.

Each question to be decided on the floor is first put to a voice vote. Before the final result of that vote is announced, any Member may demand a division vote or seek an electronically recorded vote. During a division vote, the Members favoring the question, and then those opposing it, stand and are counted. During a vote using the House’s electronic voting system, Members have at least 15 minutes to come to
the floor and cast their votes.

In the House, if the Speaker sustains a point of order against a voice or division
vote on the grounds that a quorum was not present, an electronic vote takes place
automatically to decide the question and establish the presence of a quorum. If a
quorum is present, 1/5 of those Members can secure an electronic vote in the House
by invoking their constitutional right to demand “the yeas and nays.”

In Committee of the Whole, 25 Members can secure an electronic vote on the
pending amendment or motion. If a quorum is not present in Committee of the
Whole, a Member first can require that a quorum call take place before the chair
counts to determine if there is sufficient support to order an electronically recorded
vote.

[Threadkiller]

Joan, if I understood Jane’s non-gotcha question, she was curious about anything we may have done differently. I am in no way faulting Trump for any of his handling up until the Pelosi Siege began on Monday. At which point I am questioning one aspect of the administration’s approach.

I believe JOM is above making select opinions part of broad inaccurate generalizations.

[Jim Eagle]

Frederick and I just back from a long run to Target to see if they had TP. Of course, we knew it was like backing a 500-1 nag with a limp at the track and we weren't disappointed. So we got coffee capsules they don't have at Publix, some mags of wine on sale and more of his kind of junk:)

What we did notice is parking spots, empty ones, you usually don't see there. Then on the way home through Flagler Beach, a ghost town. I don't know about OL's tenants but I find it hard to believe those small restaurants and bars can survive more than 2 weeks of this. And then when the curfew is lifted they may have to undercut their prices just to meet their costs sans any profit.

Almost got to 90F today, still in JAX records for high temps were broken the last 2 days. I am just hopeful that the heat kills this thing and normalcy can return to everyone's psyche and physical well being.

Ex, if JFK was still alive and his Dad had that ghost writer on retainer, Massie would be a Profile in Courage. In a way, I agree with him. Something this dramatic to our national fiscal health should have at least had a risk assessment to demonstrate the positive and negative outcomes. My sense is in the long run it will have massive negaitve outcomes unless we find a way to address the trade imbalance with China and our dependency on their cheap labor which I think has not been fully analyzed in the last few years compared to not depending on them.

I see a paradigm shift but to what I have no idea.

[Old Lurker]

Jane I just wrote a long answer to your question then deleted it rather than post it.

I don't pretend to know more than Trump knows, I did not go to doctor school like Fauci, I cannot say for sure which proponents of what action are grinding their own axes, and I don't know a fraction about this stuff compared to A-mom.

But I do know that I have no faith in my government leaders, I do know that one size fits all decided in a closed room in DC is NEVER the right approach, and I am stunned that we just in one month spent FOUR TIMES what we spent on WWII over FIVE YEARS (adjusted for inflation) and cannot say with any certainty that we won anything or if in fact there was anything to win. And we did that with virtually no discussion, debate and for damn sure we did it with NO discussion about the costs v benefits of the actions crammed down on us by our bettors.

[Extraneus]

I didn't like the Twitter blowup on Massie, either, but Trump is obviously losing patience. He's been putting in a lot of hours lately, and just yesterday he tweeted that he's "in non-stop meetings and has no time for stupidity," or something to that effect. The Massie thing obviously struck him as stupid and he reacted. I hope they kiss and make up - he doesn't need another Justin Amash.

[anonamom]

TK, shutting off the incoming sooner is all I can think of as well--but was that possible? I am not about to try to go back and see what the numbers were when he did close off Europe, but I do NOT think he would have had support to do so.

All in all, we are damned lucky he is in the WH.
Look at who/what he is holding off--almost all alone.

And we'll see how big a man he is, if he apologizes to Massie, as he should. Lots of short tempers all over.

Please continue holding him and his team in prayer.

[henry]

Joan, this isn’t all on Trump. Governors panicked and shut down way too many states, while encouraging imprudence in the hot spots (aka urban areas). The result is a disaster. Worse than the waste of money in the bill are the 550 pages of leftist policy tacked on. No opposition to unions, no dividends, an expectation for permanent inflated unemployment benefits. These things will cause permanent damage to the economy. I will not applaud such a travesty.

[matt - deplore me if you must]

My post linking Charlie Martin's explanation of how the media are manipulating the numbers em to have been deleted.

He's on PJMedia.

[Threadkiller]

This is interesting, Ext:

Each question to be decided on the floor is first put to a voice vote. Before the final result of that vote is announced, any Member may demand a division vote or seek an electronically recorded vote. During a division vote, the Members favoring the question, and then those opposing it, stand and are counted. During a vote using the House’s electronic voting system, Members have at least 15 minutes to come to the floor and cast their votes.

In the House, if the Speaker sustains a point of order against a voice or division vote on the grounds that a quorum was not present, an electronic vote takes place automatically to decide the question and establish the presence of a quorum.

So Massie, according to his tweet above, was only asking for a vote count, not a quorum call. I will have to look elsewhere to see if he planned on a quorum request.

If not, then the only delay would have been by the Speaker if she called for a quorum/voice vote after the fact. Presumably all the people left in DC had the votes and could have signed onto the bill with no real delay.

Unless Massie called for a quorum, and less than the 200 or so House Members we’re still there DOING THEIR JOB, he couldn’t have possibly delayed the bill more that the allotted time to say Aye 200 times.

[Extraneus]

Btw, it could have been worse!

Top Six Awful Democrat Ideas Senate Republicans Blocked from Coronavirus Bill

[MissMarple2]

Extraneus, joan, anonamom,

I came back after I thought I could hold my temper. I have tried very hard not to lose it, but I absolutely will NOT criticize a man who gave up a comfortable, in fact lavish, life style to come and rescue this country, with almost NO help from anyone in DC.

I had grandparents who were young adults during the Spanish flu epidemic in 1918. I had great aunts and uncles who died during that pandemic. They are almost all buried in the cemeteries in Corydon, Indiana or the Lutheran cemetery in Indianapolis. It changed my dad's future (he was born in 1919) and broke one of my great-grandmothers. My relatives in southern Indiana lost their farm. My dad's parents went to help a brother ranch in Texas, which broke my dad's mom, who became an alcoholic and died when I was an infant.

Multiply that by family after family throughout that pandemic, and then, voila - the Great Depression.

I want my children and grandchildren to have a brighter future. I want this country to pull together and act like we can get along, even if we disagree.

I want to see people turning back to their faith, to cherishing this nation, to supporting our troops and respecting the flag, to earning a decent income even if it's with the sweat of their brow rather than their brains.

We need President Trump for a second term. If people think this CARES Act isn't great, well, they can suck it up. At least the Chinese aren't landing on the beaches of Nantucket and Miami. We are at war, whether anyone cares to admit it or not.

I agree with this thread by Carlos Osweda:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1243619987685658624.html

[Threadkiller]

I hope they kiss and make up - he doesn't need another Justin Amash.

I ❤️ Ext. I agree completely.

[Jane]

OL,

I agree with that, and get it. But what would you have done differently. I hated Pelosi's BS, but if you need a bill to pass now, you have to deal with. I hate the thought of putting the whole country on welfare, but what are the alternatives? Is it okay to just let all the laid off people suffer until it's fixed. I don't know. Is it okay to let the entire economy collapse. I don't know. I would much have preferred a free market, but is that an option? I don't know. Any ideas?

[Old Lurker]

Maryland passed a law last year and is now enforcing it because of COVID, that makes it a crime to "price gouge" during an emergency. What is "price gouging"? It is pricing any essential (undefined) item for more than 10% of the seller's cost (undefined). So of course the local TV cameras are doing 60 Minute gotchas on every mom and pop trying to stay in business.

Did I say LUNACY?

[Threadkiller]

And we'll see how big a man he is, if he apologizes to Massie, as he should.

I ❤️ Amom as well!

Off to be productive.

[Extraneus]

Aw. [Heh heh]

[Jim Eagle]

henry,

Talk about shutting down states. I am big DeSantis supporter. Know him. Had him to our home. But doing a state wide shutdown of the beaches in my opinion was crazy. There are ways to educated people on how to use the beach. Signs, volunteers, messaging via digital signs etc. There are parts of our coastline like my spot on earth where the only people on the beach are walking their dog, not gathering in any kind of crowd.

By doing that, he has unecesarrily criplled every small business in every beach community of which Florida has too many to enumerate. I don't get it, I thought sun and fresh air is or was the best medicine. Sure there are some beaches, like Ft. Lauderdale, Daytona, South Beach, Destin that need to enforce separation but the whole coastline of Florida? To me that is what i call a lazy over-reaction. Instead of studying it just do a carte blance and be over it.

Another example of political over-reaction.

[MissMarple2]

This is the link the White House gave for the press conference. It hasn't gone live yet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESRi5j8PceY

[Another Bob]

Massie is fighting the right war, he picked a bad hill to die on.

[Jane]

Lots of members of congress testing positive. We might get rid of them the honest way.

[GUS]

How many rights will be violated NEXT YEAR,and how much will we spend on the KENNEDY CENTER if next year has a bad flu or other illness.

Politicians need to meet the rope.

[henry]

JiB, yes. Here Evers claims the Chamber of Commerce (Milwaukee version) twisted his arm. Ryan’s people and #NeverTrump to a roach. Yet hardest hit will be small business owners, investors, and retirees. The Chamber big business types will lose- innovative small business competitors. I bet they are in full Scrooge McDuck money bathsright now.

[Extraneus]

We are marshalling the full power of government and society to achieve victory over the virus. Together, we will endure, we will prevail, and we will WIN! #CARESAct pic.twitter.com/zb2PJTldGQ

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) March 27, 2020

(Click to open.)

[MissMarple2]

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
24m
We are marshalling the full power of government and society to achieve victory over the virus. Together, we will endure, we will prevail, and we will WIN! #CARESAct

=======================
I don't care what anyone says, as far as I am concerned this was a deliberate attack and we are at war.

[Threadkiller]

Is it okay to let the entire economy collapse. I don't know. I would much have preferred a free market, but is that an option? I don't know. Any ideas?

Years ago Jonathan Turley was testifying to congress about the increasing irrelevance of Congress. He noted that Obama, still president at the time, managed to save defunded government entities by using “discretionary funds” that were given to the executive. More frightening Obama wave the entire Lybian war with those same discretionary funds, entirely bypassing congress.

Could Trump on Monday have said “F these guys in the House,” explained Obama’s war funding and challenged anyone to object to his use of those funds to salvage America? My guess is yes.

Would the detractors say negative things about Trump? Of course. But that is normal.

[Old Lurker]

Jane as to that narrow question given that we are where we are, a Profile in Courage Leader would have said "These are the steps that are required today to address only the problems caused by this emergency right now, and the bill I seek from Congress will be short, will provide resources only for those problems, and will leave for another day political fights and divisions not related to the problems enumerated. Hard as these times are, I WILL NOT SIGN a bill that does more than address just these matters, or one that seeks to change the balance of power between and among groups of citizens, or one that creates a permanently expanded government, and for sure I will not sign a bill that Congress has not read and debated or which the average citizen cannot understand.

Bring me a clean bill and I will sign it before you have left the room.

Play games, and damage done to the American People is on you.

[Another Bob]

“ shutting off the incoming sooner is all I can think of as well--but was that possible?”

Agree amom. It would have been Trump the racist, Trump the fascist, etc. etc. Hawaiian district court judge overturning it all. A mess.

[Another Bob]

What’s up with the guy second from the right and his right arm?

[D]

Jane:
Like I said fighting is Threadkiller ‘s modus operandi.
That and insulting people when he is losing the argument.
Come on TK , you are better than this.
Joan summed it up correctly.
OL;
Your grandkids will be fine. If they are successful as you have been they will be fine.
Massie wanted attention.
He got it and it was negative.
Pissing off the CIC is a foolish move .
Now he can’t fly below the radar and has a target on his back.
Did his constituents support his stand?
I would like to see polling on that.

[MissMarple2]

AB,

Looks to me like he's an amputee. I don't recognize him, so can't look him up to see what his biography is.

[Another Bob]

OL, that’s a nice statement Trump could have made, but you surely know how that would have turned out.

[Threadkiller]

Come on TK , you are better than this.

I didn’t leave here soon enough.

I have left a whole bunch of comments for you to figure out what I have been talking about, maryrose. Good luck!

[D]

Another Bob:
Excellent post!

[GUS]

In 3 years when we have a HORRID NEW FLU, how many rights will be left to violate?? How much will we spend on PLANNED PARENTHOOD then,

[Jane]

JIB,

That was a reaction to spring break which he got creamed for. Hopefully he amends it soon.

[D]

TK:
You can stop by saying I am not figuring out what you said. I know when I am being insulted so own what you post.
Crack about Romney uncalled for.
Did I like that Trump kidded about Romney and the virus.
But I didn’t mention it here. You brought it up to insult me.

[caro]

OL, why won’t you get rent money from these small businesses that are getting loans to keep them afloat? My kids just relinquished their $3k security deposit toward April rent of $4k. No way they can open now before June. I thought the “loans” were forgiven if the money went to rent and/or payroll.

I agree an apology to Massie is in order, but that’s not how our president rolls.

[GUS]

When does the "GOVERNMENT" shut down free speech and those who might disagree with the VIOLATIONS of the CONSTITUTION that are currently just fine with many of you.

[Threadkiller]

Pissing off the CIC is a foolish move .

Speaking of backtracking..

I’m so old, I remember when Romney was the better man over a pissed off CIC. Maybe we should track Massie’s vote record with the Trump agenda? That was once a valuable metric!