Nuke The Debt Ceiling!

Joe Biden gets on board with an idea whose time is coming - use the Senate 'nuclear option' to put debt ceiling legislation beyond the filibuster. Both parties have done this with judges and Cocaine Mitch says he is fine with raising the debt ceiling as long as there are no Republican votes backing it.

Prior to the crushing defeats in the Georgia Senate run-offs that gave Sen. Schumer 50 votes in the Senate, Republicans warned that in such a scenario Democrats would end the filibuster entirely and squeeze through bills on DC statehood and an expanded Supreme Court with 50 votes plus VP Harris. Sen. Manchin has rejected that concept but he was apparently silent on nuking the filibuster:

Senate Democrats discussed carving out the exception at their weekly lunch on Tuesday. No conclusions were reached, but notably, according to participants, the two strongest opponents of filibuster changes, Senators Joe Manchin III of West Virginia and Kyrsten Sinema of Arizona, did not speak up in protest. They also did not speak up in support.

This debt ceiling stand-off will be resolved with a gimmicky trick play. My current guess ranks the nuclear option at Number One because it is quick and no more politically painful than reconciliation. Reconciliation is my second guess - its cumbersome and uses a scarce resource since per the current Senate "rules" (LOL) the Dems can only use it twice per session. (Their current plan is to use their second Reconciliation Card on the shrinking $3.5 trillion Social Justice and More bill, but they may do that next January in a new session.)

My third choice is a gadget play to be named later. The fourth choice last gasp is the Trillion Dollar Platinum coin. I don't think the coin is "legal" within the spirit of the law but in the current environment the real question is, can Treasury and Fed lawyers agree its 'legal enough', given the dire alternatives? As a recent example of this mentality, Biden extended the CDC eviction moratorium knowing the courts would eventually shoot it down (The Supreme Court did so, three weeks later.)

As to the platinum coin, I agree with this from Krugman:

Would any of these approaches basically mean using silly gimmicks to avoid catastrophe? Possibly yes. But given the stakes, who cares if the approach sounds silly?

Would using any of these gimmicks involve violating the spirit of the law even if they technically obey the letter? Of course — but Republicans are already doing that through their abuse of the debt ceiling.

Would any attempt to do an end run around the debt ceiling face court challenges? Yes. But the legal process would at the very least buy time to devise a better solution.

Well, yes - the trillion dollar coin is a terrible idea (per SecTreas Yellen!) but maybe not compared to the other terrible ideas on the menu. As to legal challenges, there is a real question about just who might have standing to sue if a coin were issued.

We should find out soon enough. My money is on nukes.

ERRATA: Rohan Grey, a young progressive professor, has a solid piece on the legal background to a platinum coin. We chatted on Twitter and I came away agreeing that the coin is legal enough that Federal Reserve lawyers could make a political decision to go either way. On the one had, I'd say that accepting the coin calls into question their independence. OTOH, rejecting it puts them in the role of refereeing a partisan Executive-Legislative showdown during a bond market meltdown. Both paths are perilous.

 

Comments

[Melinda]

Changing fiat does not convey "value" to it, I don't believe.

[Narciso]

as mark levin pointed out, this is dangerous foolishness, from shambling man, or whoever is pulling his strings,

[Narciso]

the debt, social security and pensions must be paid from incoming tax revenues, gah

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/robert-spencer/2021/10/05/thanks-joe-taliban-gives-tajik-jihadis-u-s-made-weaponry-and-vehicles-n1521963

[Narciso]

it's like those million dollar rounds in john wick 2,

[Narciso]

the possums put garland, mayorkas austin et al over the top, so tell us that story about the brave 50,

[Narciso]

yep

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2021/10/06/the_dirt_on_dems_reconciliation_bill_146521.html

[Narciso]

how does a law professor, not know article 1 section 8, what else don't they know (multitudes)

[Melinda]

Glenn Kessler
@GlennKesslerWP
Secret trove illuminates the lives of billionaires washingtonpost.com/business/inter…

https://twitter.com/GlennKesslerWP/status/1445753023788040199

Too funny.

[Narciso]

shambling man, is still underwater by 5-9 points his best showing is yougov, which is heavily dalek

[Neo]

Just loved this line ...
"Remember: They’ll spend trillions on bills they haven’t read but want details on how you spent $600."

[Narciso]

of course, comandante krugman exemplar of central planning hari seldon was killed off in the first episode of foundation,

[Melinda]

Seldon has to die for Foundation to work....

[Melinda]

Fresh Emerald:

How The Federalist Society Betrayed Conservatives
Who picked this gang of idiots for the Supreme Court?

https://emeralddb3.substack.com/p/how-the-federalist-society-betrayed

[Jim Eagle]

Imagine running your household income and expenses like this?

[Neo]

U.S. Attorney General Merrick Garland has indirectly placed the electoral cross-hairs on school boards across this nation.

[Melinda]

Sweden says no Moderna shots for people under 30
Alex Berenson 15 min ago
39
To be clear: if the Moderna shot is unacceptable for people under 30 because of heart risk, the Pfizer shot should be too. They are effectively the same product, far far more alike than different; the primary difference is dosage. And Pfizer shows very significant myocarditis increased risk too. Remember- this problem was first seen in Israel, where only Pfizer is used.

https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/sweden-says-no-moderna-shots-for/comments

[Thomas Collins]

Melinda, where do I get one of those trillion dollar platinum coins Yellen is considering minting? Just think how many champagne rooms with Destiny and Tatiana that would mean!

[Melinda]

Wuhan scientists and US researchers planned to create a new coronavirus in 2018: Consortium led by Brit Peter Daszak asked DARPA to fund research at lab in city where Covid pandemic began

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10062775/US-Chinese-scientists-planning-create-brand-new-coronavirus-leaked-proposals-show.html

[Thomas Collins]

Of course, after we become Zimbabwe without the safari animals, one of those coins won't even buy a sit down drink with Destiny or Tatiana.

[Narciso]

yes brie larson wannabe is not the story

https://twitter.com/tomselliott/status/1445696839391481865

[Melinda]

Accidental leak reveals US government has secretly hit Google with 'keyword warrants' to identify ANYONE searching certain names, addresses, and phone numbers

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10063665/Government-orders-Google-track-searching-certain-names-addresses-phone-numbers.html

[sbwaters]

Regarding debt limits, ay attention to see if the #MSM clarifies "raise" or "suspend" the limit in #news reports.

"Raise" sets a new higher limit. "Suspend" means anything goes. #Democrats will likely suspend.

[Narciso]

suspend, means katie bar the door, because godzillas coming,

[Old Lurker]

SBW, the goal has always been to have no debt ceiling limit at all, rather to classify ANY approved spending law as defacto approved debt when whatever the administrators say the law requires them to spend in out years is revealed. That way they will have to pass new laws one by one to roll back spending...and we know how good they are at that.

[Narciso]

pikers,

https://hitchhikers.fandom.com/wiki/Triganic_Pu

[Old Lurker]

It is the same mirror trick Obama tried when he described the US Constitution as "Negative Rights" so that all natural rights should be owned by the State unless and until the State makes some of them available to individuals. For the moment.

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

There is only a "crisis" because the Dems don't want to use reconciliation, which is available to them for an issue they have known was coming for months.
Nuking the filibuster and imbecilic crap like trillion dollar coins are destructive and stupid solutions to a problem that exists only because the Dems are lazy and crooked.

As to Krugman - the "spirit of the law" requires Republicans to vote for it? That's an interesting take, rather like the Politburo's used to be. How can anyone take that demented leftist hack seriously?

[Narciso]

red squaw on the war path,

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-05/ransomware-bill-would-give-victims-48-hours-to-report-payments

[Old Lurker]

The surprise is not what the Progs want. It is how easy it has become for them to get it.

[clarice]

https://www.nationandstate.com/2021/10/06/conflict-of-interest-ag-garlands-family-getting-rich-selling-critical-race-theory-materials-to-schools/

[Narciso]

I noted that in one of the blatherings in a npr interview obama gave, explaining his mindthoughts

[clarice]

https://www.nationandstate.com/2021/10/05/the-devolution-of-the-doj/

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

What DC will never discuss, either party, is returning the Federal government to its proper Constitutional role at which point our debt would shrinking drastically and those idiots would be voting for a debt floor.

[Narciso]

ministry of love, clarice, get the nomemclature right, you could imagine harvey korman as garland,

[Narciso]

like the teachers union and the cdc, just drop coin, wallah

https://twitter.com/DrKarlynB/status/1445603353577148424?s=20

[Melinda]

Don Surber
@donsurber
Don Surber: Biden official wrote, "How to Kill a Country." donsurber.blogspot.com/2021/10/biden-…

https://twitter.com/donsurber/status/1445772490941210636

https://donsurber.blogspot.com/2021/10/biden-official-wrote-how-to-kill-country.html?spref=tw

[Samantha Power, of course]

[clarice]

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/greg-gutfeld-joe-biden-unifier

[Narciso]

a sensible fellow, so of course he has to be 'far right'

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2021/10/06/far-right-tv-host-overtakes-le-pen-polls-could-face-macron-presidential/

[DCSCA]

A 'trillion dollar coin' is no more silly than the silliness these two political parties keep doing by playing chicken and damaging the "full faith and credit" of the U.S., causing havoc in global markets and only adding to the perception of a nation in decline. The American Century: born 12/7/41, peaked 7/20/69; died 9/11/01. All these parties are doing is passing the shovel back and forth for burial.

[Neo]

Why not a quadrillion dollar coin ?

[Narciso]

there was a bunny boiling on the pot at the msnbc commissary,

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2021/10/stephanie_grisham_called_out_by_steve_scalise_for_boldfaced_lie_in_her_antitrump_tellall_book.html

[Narciso]

see my 11;14 neo,

[Melinda]

Zade Smith @ZadeSmith6
14h
Facebook definitely shut down, but not for this lying wench…. Something is up.

@whitecat8765301
Replying to @ZadeSmith6 @JovanHPulitzer
From her feed

https://twitter.com/whitecat8765301/status/1445762568002301965

[Narciso]

she's richard clarke in chanel,

[DCSCA]

OT-active shooter at high school, Arlington, Texas.

Awful.

[Neo]

Joe Biden gonna put y'all back in blockchains...

[Narciso]

actually, miss omarova, wants to get rid of block chain,

[DCSCA]

Ratings warning: The canary in the coal mine: Fox's "Gutfeld!"

[DCSCA]

Republicans stormed the Castle in January; Democrats stormed the Throne Room over the weekend.

Populism is alive-- and growing.

When President Plagiarist supports tracking $600 transactions in your bank account, expect more of it, too.

[Rick Ballard]

OL,

If this situation were not more farce than tragedy, I'd say we have reached the point of "A tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."

I would suggest small sacks of magic beans as being just as effective and less costly than platinum coins. Just as wearing a necklace of syringes and a gauze muzzle are effective talismans against Wuflu.

I doubt any of those to be effective against rising resentment among those living on the shady side of the Bell Curve and I anticipate the Democrat Party to once again reap the whirlwind they have sown.

[Narciso]

yes they've gone vizzini, what is the currency in florin again?

[Neo]

And if social media were as responsible for polarizing society as some people claim, then why are we seeing polarization increase in the US while it stays flat or declines in many countries with just as heavy use of social media around the world? -- Mark Zuckerberg

[Dave (in MA)]

OT-active shooter at high school, Arlington, Texas.

Awful.

Another case of White Rage, apparently.

[Narciso]

reading from the book of kendi, chapter 3, that can't go pearshaped,

[Old Lurker]

Rick "...among those living on the shady side of the Bell Curve..."

I don't think you are allowed to say "Bell Curve" anymore.

There is a TV commercial that drives me NUTS. It is for one of those online universities and the scene is the President speaking to the current crop of graduates, all decked out in fancy robes. In his speech, he states "We are all blessed with equal talents and therefore(you need this school...)".

Un-fricken-believable.

[Narciso]

I thought I was the only one who got twitchy with that one,

[Ignatz Ratzkiwatzki]

--Rohan Grey, a young progressive professor, has a solid piece on the legal background to a platinum coin. We chatted on Twitter and I came away agreeing that the coin is legal enough that Federal Reserve lawyers could make a political decision to go either way.--

On its face the literalist argument is retarded. Congress, of course, did not and could not grant to the executive an unlimited method of funding the government that does not involve congress which controls the power of the purse by the direct language of the Constitution.
This guy demonstrates the absurdist arguments of Grey and the MMT imbeciles trying to use the banana republic, Franklin Mint method of staying afloat.

If they do mint one I hope they'll have the honesty to put that crusty old commie Robert Mugabe's likeness on it.

[Narciso]

you thought I was kidding

https://t.me/The_Library_II/56809

[Jim Eagle]

More White Rage, this time in Utah:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10064715/Moment-University-Utah-football-player-Aaron-Lowe-shot-and.html

[Narciso]

I think alien ants explains this, laura was interviewing hershel walker's son, who is a student at ucla, where they are mandate proof of vaccination, even though all his classes are online,

[DCSCA]

Worst.
POTUS.
Ever.

... and Carter smiled.

[Buckeye]

“And if social media were as responsible for polarizing society as some people claim, then why are we seeing polarization increase in the US while it stays flat or declines in many countries with just as heavy use of social media around the world? “ - Mark Zuckerberg

Because you aren’t corrupting the elections in those countries Mark. That’s why.

[Rick Ballard]

OL,

I've always believed Danton's final thought was probably along the lines of "boy, didn't see that one coming" rather than "égalité forever" as his head hit the basket.

Pretending the Bell Curve doesn't exist doesn't have much to do with its existence - as we will continue to observe as the Peter Principle operates at warp speed wherever égalité is implemented.

[Old Lurker]

Rick, one would have thought an early task for a committee on public safety might have been to remove all sharp falling objects.

[jimmyk]

... and Carter smiled.

I keep a running list of worst presidents ever.
Carter
Obama
Biden

Most overrated, and almost as bad as the above:
Clinton

Essentially gave us 2008 financial crisis, 9/11, and indelible memories of cigars and a stained blue dress.

[clarice]

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/575583-mcconnell-to-propose-deal-with-schumer-to-solve-debt-impasse
You may not like McConnell but you can't say he isn't the best parliamentarian and very shrewd.

[henry]

Yes. McTurtle shrewdly sees that Schumer gets everything he wants. All while pretending to slow things down.

[Narciso]

quelle surprise, what struck me about the terror's leadership is they were premature sjw, antislavery, secular, feminist, all the trendy ism, in embryo,

[Narciso]

shambling man's greatest hits,

https://twitter.com/TPostMillennial/status/1445485571346866178/video/1

[Narciso]

what kind of a compromise is that, leaning into the idiocy,

[MJW]

McTurtle shrewdly sees that Schumer gets everything he wants.

Like Merrick Garland on the Supreme Court.

[Narciso]

how many possums voted for garland as atty general again?

https://spectator.org/yom-kippur-war-righteous-richard-nixon/

[clarice]

I think McConnell is making the Dems shut down the govt.if they don't agree to his proposal. Shifts the responsibility.

[MJW]

how many possums voted for garland as atty general again?

Many Republicans still hold to the traditional view that a President's nominees for executive positions should be approved except when they're clearly unqualified. I think they somewhat foolishly hope the Democrats will be inspired by their example to restore Senate comity.

However, suppose all the Republicans had voted against Garland -- he'd still be AG. And would you rather have him the AG for four or so years, or a SCOTUS justice for life?

As irksome as McConnell can be (and he can be very irksome), he earned eternal gratitude for stopping Garland from getting on the court.

[henry]

Who remembers the “responsibility” five minutes after the deed is done? Yet we have to live with the consequences forever.

[MJW]

Who remembers the “responsibility” five minutes after the deed is done? Yet we have to live with the consequences forever.

You seem to suggest McConnell has some method to stop the Democrats that he's not using. He doesn't. The Democrats have the votes. McConnell must play the hand he's dealt, not the hand you wish he had.

[Narciso]

heads you win, tails you lose,

[sbwaters]

McConnell counters #Schumer’s unlimited debt limit suspension offering two months fixed dollar increase and time to negotiate.

Dems want to bust the #Filibuster, get liberty to spend everything & more, and blame Republicans.

Turtle playing his poor hand, if you’ll pardon the expression, with finesse.

[MJW]

Just in case I come across as a blind McConnell defender, I'm not at all. I believe the way McConnell handled the election dispute discouraged Republican voters, and was largely responsible for the loss of both Georgia Senate seats -- which is what caused most of the present problems.

[sbwaters]

Spent too much time trying to import photos from my iPhone to my Mac with no success — reboots, different cables, program updates ...

Then I recalled an insight passed on long ago, grabbed a toothpick and cleaned tiny bits of lint from the Lightning connector socket. Yay! Success!

Whatever one may have thought of Rush Limbaugh, you have to give him credit for that bit of useful information. Thanks, Rush!

[Jim Eagle]

The Senate protects the Senate.

We mere mortals stand on a precipice whether to believe their comity to protect us or take the chance by jumping and some other body will save us.

When I was in DC I found out in a hurry that knowing Senators and Congressman was not as critical than knowing their staff both on Committees and office.

[Narciso]

meanwhile shambling man's train is going off a cliff, and turtle says dial the throttle up

[Jane]

I agree Clarice.

[henry]

I simply observe that when McTurtle and Rs had majorities, nothing happened. Schumer threatened and the Turtle manned the top of his post. No threats to end the filibuster, just a lame I might get mad if you knock me senseless. No way to stand up to a bully. No way to slow or stop the mad rush to statism. So I conclude he wants the statism.

[MJW]

The Senate protects the Senate.

That was true not too long ago, but I think it's true no longer. During Trump's presidency, the Senate Democrats pretty much abandoned the respect members had for Senate traditions, in favor of pure partisanship.

[MJW]

I simply observe that when McTurtle and Rs had majorities, nothing happened.

I do recall a pretty significant tax cut.

[clarice]

https://gatesofvienna.net/2021/10/why-is-china-so-dangerous/#more-52727

[henry]

Tax cut, which increased government revenue (as tax cuts do). Where were any reductions in government? Everything got bigger. Not just DOD (which Trump asked for).

[DCSCA]

50 years of swamp creature plagiaristic experience = proposed $3.5 trillion of spending won't cost anything; 100% is 90%; $2000 is $1400; abandons $85 billion in equipment; kills 13 service people; no secure borders, no Covid tests for illegals; mandatory shots for citizens; lies about driving 18 wheelers; can't walk up stairs nor remember the names of world leaders. And 'never trumper' conservatives like David French and Patterwoke-o back this jerk.

He's a bum.

[MJW]

No threats to end the filibuster

That goes along with what I said in my comment about the Senate protecting itself. During the first years of Obama, when the Democrats held a large Senate majority, they settled for a rather unsatisfactory trick to push through Obamacare. They didn't end the filibuster, or even seriously consider ending it. It's the current situation that's an anomaly. Until recently, the filibusterer has survived essentially unchallenged through many Democratic and Republican majorities.

[clarice]

Henry, it was just a paper majority--you had Collins, Murkowski and Romney, i.e.

[henry]

Clarice, understood. Why not expose them as frauds so they can be erased from political influence? How can losing them be worse than keeping them has turned out?

[henry]

As I recall, the only reason Murkowski is still in the Senate is because McTurtle backed her run as an independent after her primary loss. Revealing episode there.

[MJW]

Tax cut, which increased government revenue (as tax cuts do). Where were any reductions in government? Everything got bigger.

I guess you didn't like the goal posts where you initially put them. You said "nothing happened." I thought showing something that happened was a sufficient response.

[henry]

Not a goal post move. A denial of the relevance of a tax cut.

[DCSCA]

$5 gasoline.

'Course that doesn't bother ol'18-wheeler, choo-Amtrak Joe- trucks and trains use diesel.

[henry]

A tax cut which reduced the percentage of people paying federal income taxes to less than 50% while increasing tax credits to the “poor”. Turning the tax code into another welfare program. And a McTurtle bonus: fewer people paying tax means fewer people upset at his increasing cost and scope of government.

[MJW]

How can losing them be worse than keeping them has turned out?

Because they vote most of the time with the Republicans, with some very annoying exception, while a Democratic replacement would vote 99% with the Democrats? That might be worse.

That said, Collins is in a different category than Romney. If Collins weren't a Maine Senator, a Democrat most likely would be. If Romney weren't a Utah Senator, a better Republican would most likely be. So Collins should be tolerated while Romney shouldn't.

[DCSCA]

Republicans stormed the Castle; Democrats stormed the Throne Room. Populism is growing; citizen demand accountability from trhe people who work for them: elected politicians. And lest you forget:

MAY 5, 1970: THE UW FREEWAY MARCH

“Was the Kent State Massacre not a sufficient wake-up call for a complacent nation?”

"On Tuesday, May 5, 1970, at approximately 1:50 pm 6,000 University of Washington (UW) students marched off campus and poured on to the Interstate 5 freeway and headed south towards the Federal Courthouse. The students entered the freeway shouting anti-Vietnam War slogans, carrying protest banners and sporting peace signs."

https://www.seattlestar.net/2014/05/may-5-1970-the-uw-freeway-march/

[DCSCA]

The Dollar Store is now charging $1.25 and $1.50 for goods.

Inflation, Joe.

Social Security recipients on fixed incomes thank you...

IDIOT.